Bick
Administrator
Posts: 6,900
|
Post by Bick on Jan 18, 2020 20:07:37 GMT -8
I know addictions are commonly considered to be a disease, but I've always considered them a function of weakness / choice.
This will sound hypocritical given my belief homosexuality is NOT a choice.
I think addictive behavior is prevalent in many people, including me, and that lure is damn near impossible to control, so no judgement on my part.
I just don't see diseases as a choice.
|
|
|
Post by captaintrips on Jan 18, 2020 20:33:10 GMT -8
I know addictions are commonly considered to be a disease, but I've always considered them a function of weakness / choice. This will sound hypocritical given my belief homosexuality is NOT a choice. I think addictive behavior is prevalent in many people, including me, and that lure is damn near impossible to control, so no judgement on my part. I just don't see diseases as a choice. It always depends on who gets to and how they decide to define what a " disease" is. I always considered a disease to be infection by a micro-organism or a genetic mutation or anomaly. Now days we seem to like to call anything that is a problem for someone a disease. I do not agree with calling alcoholism a disease for instance. Calling ANY addictive behaviour a disease is silly I think. People get addicted to sugar and get into problems FROM that, but is addiction to drinking liters of soda every day a disease ? Is diabetes caused by that that a disease ? Or is it just a symptom of the long-term abuse to systems of the body ? Lot of differing opinions on these matters I think.
|
|
RSM789
Eminence Grise
Posts: 2,286
|
Post by RSM789 on Jan 19, 2020 12:03:27 GMT -8
From what I have read, the propensity to become addicted is DNA based. Think of the old stereotype of Native Americans and alcohol.
However, you can have that propensity and never have the "disease" by simply avoiding that which you can become addicted to. Note that simply does not mean easily.
So addiction is not a disease, it is a choice to do or use things that create issues with your body due to your specific DNA differences.
|
|
|
Post by captaintrips on Jan 19, 2020 12:56:36 GMT -8
From what I have read, the propensity to become addicted is DNA based. Think of the old stereotype of Native Americans and alcohol. However, you can have that propensity and never have the "disease" by simply avoiding that which you can become addicted to. Note that simply does not mean easily. So addiction is not a disease, it is a choice to do or use things that create issues with your body due to your specific DNA differences. I have to agree somewhat. The Irish & Russian gene pool have that tendency too it would seem. Calling certain arrangements of DNA diseases makes no sense unless they are arrangements that cause real dysfunction in healthy living. Like sickle cell
|
|
davidsf
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 5,252
|
Post by davidsf on Jan 19, 2020 16:15:33 GMT -8
From what I have read, the propensity to become addicted is DNA based. Think of the old stereotype of Native Americans and alcohol. However, you can have that propensity and never have the "disease" by simply avoiding that which you can become addicted to. Note that simply does not mean easily. So addiction is not a disease, it is a choice to do or use things that create issues with your body due to your specific DNA differences. I agree, the leaning towards one substance or another is DNA-born, or, maybe we can’t just say “substance” if we want to include, for example, sexual aberrations amongst addictions. But does that make them diseases? i was addicted to cigarettes back in my 20’s. Of course, that was a simpler time when we didn’t categorize anything away from personal responsibility by simply listing it as a disease, so I have never bought that chronic drug use or alcohol abuse (etc.) as a disease. It was very difficult to give up cigarettes, but I always knew “if it is to,be, it is up to me.” Needless to say, there are drugs that can quell the urges, IF it is physically needed, but I’m not so sure a sex addict needs that physical release so much as he (usually “he” but not exclusively so) needs some hole in his life filled... so, again, not sounding like a disease. didn't we start down this road back when we became frustrated that the liberals plan to treat the heroin (or whatever) addict’s addiction but kept failing because we weren’t treating underlying causes. Rather than fill the void, [shrug] “it’s a disease, let’s just give them free needles...” claiming addiction is a disease removes one’s personal responsibility to overcome it.
|
|
MDDad
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 6,814
|
Post by MDDad on Jan 19, 2020 22:30:58 GMT -8
I’m not so sure a sex addict needs that physical release so much as he (usually “he” but not exclusively so) needs some hole in his life filled... so, again, not sounding like a disease. Nice play on words there, dude.
|
|
Bick
Administrator
Posts: 6,900
|
Post by Bick on Jan 19, 2020 23:51:37 GMT -8
The AMA declared it an illness in 1956, and doctors consider it a chronic brain disease of which there is no cure. In 1992 - this excerpt from a JAMA study But this excerpt from Baldwin Research rings most true with me. It concludes that personal choice gives the greatest opportunity to defeat the condition, more so than treating it as an incurable disease. The link to the article is below. www.baldwinresearch.com/alcoholism.cfm#
|
|
SK80
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 7,376
|
Post by SK80 on Jan 20, 2020 8:45:59 GMT -8
A weakness can introduce or lead one to an addiction. That addiction can result in a disease.
|
|
MDDad
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 6,814
|
Post by MDDad on Jan 20, 2020 8:59:21 GMT -8
Exactly. It's likely a combination of both. Most people who become diabetics are those who choose to overeat and pack on an extra 100 pounds. Most people who develop lung cancer are those who choose to smoke that first cigarette. And you can't become an alcoholic or drug addict unless you choose to take that first drink or try that first drug.
|
|
davidsf
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 5,252
|
Post by davidsf on Jan 20, 2020 10:02:01 GMT -8
Exactly. It's likely a combination of both. Most people who become diabetics are those who choose to overeat and pack on an extra 100 pounds. Most people who develop lung cancer are those who choose to smoke that first cigarette. And you can't become an alcoholic or drug addict unless you choose to take that first drink or try that first drug. This is an accurate analysis, but as SK80 said, “leading to a disease,” does not make the addiction a disease.
|
|
MDDad
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 6,814
|
Post by MDDad on Jan 20, 2020 11:35:17 GMT -8
I guess I mildly disagree, as it depends on the addiction. Those who develop a physical dependence on a substance and suffer agonizing pain if deprived of it, be it opioids or some other drug, I believe have an addiction that is also a disease. They may have consciously made the decision to engage in activities that would lead to that disease, but I'm not sure that's relevant.
Now while those who don't have the willpower to push away from the dinner table may also claim to have an addiction and a disease, I don't think they do. And those who claim to be sex addicts I think are just plain full of crap.
|
|
davidsf
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 5,252
|
Post by davidsf on Jan 20, 2020 14:15:06 GMT -8
I guess I mildly disagree, as it depends on the addiction. Those who develop a physical dependence on a substance and suffer agonizing pain if deprived of it, be it opioids or some other drug, I believe have an addiction that is also a disease. They may have consciously made the decision to engage in activities that would lead to that disease, but I'm not sure that's relevant. Now while those who don't have the willpower to push away from the dinner table may also claim to have an addiction and a disease, I don't think they do. And those who claim to be sex addicts I think are just plain full of crap. OK,then, I accept that we disagree. i see no difference between the pain of a diabetic with low blood sugar and the pain of a heroin addict going through withdrawal: The latter might be more intense and/or last longer, but pain is pain.
|
|
|
Post by captaintrips on Jan 20, 2020 16:57:08 GMT -8
Good points made for both sides I think.
Maybe, ... I don't know if I'm saying anything new or not ,... it's like this; Drinking alcohol too much, isn't a disease itself, it's where your mind & body become dependent on it.
Take it away and you get the DT's, can even die - I knew someone who had someone close to them die because they were "cut off" with no medical attention during that time.
The long term consistent use of substances cause diseases - too much sugar, too much XYZ etc.
|
|