Bick
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Post by Bick on Sept 17, 2021 9:09:14 GMT -8
When the basic premise of one side is to willingly exchange those freedoms to be taken care of by growing the gov't, the respective missions in life are at odds.
This is no small issue.
With this vax issue heading as it is, we're now into coercion. Not sure what's real in Australia, but that coercion seems to be along the lines of forceful.
My concern is that if we wait too long, the separation is going to be very bloody.
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MDDad
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Post by MDDad on Sept 17, 2021 9:25:48 GMT -8
SK, you only live in a "bastion of freedom" because Gavin Newsom and the super majority in congress haven't yet decided that you shouldn't. It can all change in a heartbeat if either of them get the whim.
Whether or not we'd be better off Balkanizing the country is arguable, but there is no doubt it would be the best thing that could happen for China, Russia and our other enemies. The question becomes, does the upside from living in a "country" like Texas outweigh the downside of living in a world dominated by a totalitarian communist China as the only remaining superpower.
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thefrog
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Post by thefrog on Sept 17, 2021 9:34:22 GMT -8
All theoretical though, there isn’t an ice cube’s chance in hell of any of this happening.
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SK80
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Post by SK80 on Sept 17, 2021 10:04:08 GMT -8
SK, you only live in a "bastion of freedom" because Gavin Newsom and the super majority in congress haven't yet decided that you shouldn't. It can all change in a heartbeat if either of them get the whim. Whether or not we'd be better off Balkanizing the country is arguable, but there is no doubt it would be the best thing that could happen for China, Russia and our other enemies. The question becomes, does the upside from living in a "country" like Texas outweigh the downside of living in a world dominated by a totalitarian communist China as the only remaining superpower. Agree, one ramification of the recall with dear Gavin winning is his aim now on those whom likely started it, moved it along, became a thorn in his future aspirations, meaning Orange County and Riverside County. I was thankful that on a more minute logistic scale, throughout Covid lockdowns and mandates, Newport has been fairly free to do mostly what you please. I think I mentioned, spend about 50/50 of my days between LA/OC, its like two different countries. Agree, there will certainly be downsides to balkanizing, not sure where we go, but I'm claustrophobic at this point in regards to my freedoms. As an unvaccinated person, I am looking at or facing being excommunicated, barred and shamed as a person with what I believe to be my rights in my own country. Not sure how long this will take, or how long we can endure, but I wish some of this nonsense would make its way to the Supreme court sooner rather than later, before it is too late. |
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MDDad
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Post by MDDad on Sept 17, 2021 10:24:47 GMT -8
Maybe it comes down to this: Would you rather have Gavin Newsom/Joe Biden mandate that you must get vaccinated, or would you rather have Xi Jinping do it?
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SK80
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Post by SK80 on Sept 17, 2021 10:38:00 GMT -8
Maybe it comes down to this: Would you rather have Gavin Newsom/Joe Biden mandate that you must get vaccinated, or would you rather have Xi Jinping do it? Is that like asking would I rather jump from the 91st or 101st floor of the Empire State Building  |
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MDDad
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Post by MDDad on Sept 17, 2021 10:51:26 GMT -8
Pretty much.
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Bick
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Post by Bick on Sept 17, 2021 15:05:41 GMT -8
All theoretical though, there isn’t an ice cube’s chance in hell of any of this happening. I think I first brought this up about 10 years ago on TOB, and was pretty much laughed out of the site. Let's just say the laughter has subsided a bit. If you've got this mass exodus from CA from businesses and citizens, at some point they're not going to move, and will fight. I doubt it will just be the proud boy type either. You should see what it's like in Central CA, like I observed last weekend. VERY patriotic. |
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Bick
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Post by Bick on Sept 17, 2021 15:09:17 GMT -8
The question becomes, does the upside from living in a "country" like Texas outweigh the downside of living in a world dominated by a totalitarian communist China as the only remaining superpower. If we balkanize, I don't see the military losing a whole lot. I think the left would go the way of Canada with little to no military. But I think the right would have to charge a protection fee along the lines of NATO. |
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Post by ProfessorFate on Sept 18, 2021 0:32:23 GMT -8
This won't likely happen in our lifetime, but I think it's a real possibility in our kids' lifetime. Are you sure? I'm older than dirt, and I'm not so sure I won't see it in my lifetime. |
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Post by ProfessorFate on Sept 18, 2021 0:56:34 GMT -8
The question becomes, does the upside from living in a "country" like Texas outweigh the downside of living in a world dominated by a totalitarian communist China as the only remaining superpower. If we balkanize, I don't see the military losing a whole lot. I think the left would go the way of Canada with little to no military. But I think the right would have to charge a protection fee along the lines of NATO. I agree, Bick, that the new blue country would become like Canada. I think that the new red country would be militarily about equal to Russia...nuclear armed, but no longer a threat to invade the other side of the globe without help. China would be the top dog, but I doubt they would have any appetite for trying to invade us either, (especially as heavily armed as our citizens are), and since we, they, and Russia would all have the ability to blow up the entire planet (mutually assured destruction), nukes are out. We would rule the Americas, China would rule South Asia, and Russia would ally with Europe, and/or Japan and/or Australia, to contain China. |
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billb
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Post by billb on Sept 18, 2021 1:07:46 GMT -8
I read this thread a couple times and am still not sure if you guys are talking about a civil war or dividing the country or perhaps some state seceding from the union? I agree with you professor, I think. Any of these things can happen. The administration seems to be pushing us off a cliff with mandates.
Did anyone see this full video of the ex-Pfizer Chief Science Officer? In early videos he had been skeptical of the vaccine. He definitely didn't want to mandate it. It was too experimental.
www.lewrockwell.com/2021/09/no_author/a-final-warning-to-humanity-from-former-pfizer-chief-scientist-michael-yeadon/
Now he says we are headed for "hell" with these booster shots and vaccine passports. He doesn't think the vaccine passports are about the vaccines. This is far more sinister than that. It is all about controlling people - tyranny. I think he is right. It is obvious the vaccines aren't working.
But besides why they are pushing these mandates and should the US split up - If we did split the country, who controls the nukes?
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Post by ProfessorFate on Sept 18, 2021 1:12:55 GMT -8
I read this thread a couple times and am still not sure if you guys are talking about a civil war or dividing the country or perhaps some state seceding from the union? I agree with you professor, I think. Any of these things can happen. The administration seems to be pushing us off a cliff with mandates.
Did anyone see this full video of the ex-Pfizer Chief Science Officer? In early videos he had been skeptical of the vaccine. He definitely didn't want to mandate it. It was too experimental.
www.lewrockwell.com/2021/09/no_author/a-final-warning-to-humanity-from-former-pfizer-chief-scientist-michael-yeadon/
Now he says we are headed for "hell" with these booster shots and vaccine passports. He doesn't think the vaccine passports are about the vaccines. This is far more sinister than that. It is all about controlling people - tyranny. I think he is right. It is obvious the vaccines aren't working.
But besides why they are pushing these mandates and should the US split up - If we did split the country, who controls the nukes? I don't think the new blue country would want them. |
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billb
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Post by billb on Sept 18, 2021 1:20:47 GMT -8
Oh, in that case, then let's split the country.  |
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Post by vilepagan on Sept 18, 2021 2:30:57 GMT -8
All theoretical though, there isn’t an ice cube’s chance in hell of any of this happening. I think I first brought this up about 10 years ago on TOB, and was pretty much laughed out of the site. Let's just say the laughter has subsided a bit. If you've got this mass exodus from CA from businesses and citizens, at some point they're not going to move, and will fight. I doubt it will just be the proud boy type either. You should see what it's like in Central CA, like I observed last weekend. VERY patriotic. There still isn't an ice cube's chance in hell it will ever happen, and the laughter hasn't really subsided. We fought a war to see if states could secede and the answer is no, they cannot. It also isn't at all "patriotic" to discuss secession, it's treasonous. I'm also curious why all the best "patriots" are also the ones most likely to suggest secession. It's as if your professed love for our flag is just BS as your "solution" would destroy that very flag. |
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