Bick
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Post by Bick on May 31, 2022 16:42:01 GMT -8
When the Founding Fathers made it a point to ensure the citizens would be allowed to bear arms, I'm curious as to what that really meant to the rapid development of the US as compared to the other countries in Europe and Asia that were established centuries earlier. It seems to me that the unfettered "freedom" those arms allowed laid a foundation of innovation and self-reliance that no other country enjoyed. If we hadn't decided 2A was important, would we have been developed enough to provide the support for Europe during WW1 & WW2?
I hadn't really given much thought to a sincere argument to the notion that we're the wild west, and that we should all surrender our guns until evaluating some revisionist history.
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billb
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Post by billb on May 31, 2022 17:51:13 GMT -8
I think the main point is: If we outlaw guns the outlaws (the wild-west) will be the only ones with guns. Plus, the 2A is about keeping tyranny at bay, IMO. Besides, didn't Biden say that he had nukes which makes our measly small arms useless.  I don't see any upside to more gun regulations PLUS we should consider removing some of what we have. |
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Bick
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Post by Bick on Jun 1, 2022 6:15:01 GMT -8
I think we entirely miss the boat on the gun "problem". We have an accountability and security problem.
We don't keep the bad guys off the street, and don't secure the most vulnerable targets. Instead, we blame the cops, and secure gov't buildings.
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MDDad
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Post by MDDad on Jun 1, 2022 6:54:16 GMT -8
I still can't help but believe we're barking up the wrong tree. Securing the most vulnerable targets won't solve the problem any more than blaming the cops or securing government buildings. Shooters will just move on to the next less vulnerable targets.
Imagine a pickup truck that has been used to haul apples to market for two hundred years. Suddenly, those apples are starting to rot and leak out through the tailgate. The solution is not to seal the tailgate with duct tape so it doesn't leak. We have to get to the bottom of why the apples are suddenly rotting in the last 15 or 20 years when they never did before. Since she was so great at arriving at the root cause of illegal immigration, perhaps Joe Biden should assign Kamala Harris to find the root cause of kids shooting up grade schools.
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Bick
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Post by Bick on Jun 1, 2022 9:02:44 GMT -8
I agree that may not be the ultimate long term solution. I'll use a medical analogy as I think it best describes the situation. First step is always to stop the bleeding, then move on to evaluating whatever surgery, medication, etc to get a better shot at an acceptable fix.
That said, securing the most vulnerable would be the first step.
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tarmac
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Post by tarmac on Jun 1, 2022 10:16:46 GMT -8
"When governments fear the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government."
Thomas Jefferson.
The founding fathers didn't even trust themselves when it came to too much power.
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tarmac
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Post by tarmac on Jun 1, 2022 10:27:05 GMT -8
New York rifle and pistol association v Bruen is in the SCOTUS now. A ruling will come this month or next. If the gun club wins and it looks like they will any person who can legally own a firearm can carry the firearm on their person or car at anytime. You do not need to show "good cause" to the government to carry.
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MDDad
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Post by MDDad on Jun 1, 2022 15:34:44 GMT -8
First step is always to stop the bleeding... But that's just it. You're not stopping the bleeding, you're just moving it to a different organ. |
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Bick
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Post by Bick on Jun 1, 2022 18:59:13 GMT -8
I can live with that in the interim.
Have a hard time with kids at school being such wide open targets.
At some point, our current iteration of "rights" will be abridged, and I'm ok with that.
No women, no children... It's a code.
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Post by mrright on Jun 5, 2022 11:28:53 GMT -8
the 2nd says guns arent the govts business.
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MDDad
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Post by MDDad on Jun 8, 2022 8:16:45 GMT -8
I was reading something about presidential assassinations yesterday when I had a thought (I know, shocking, right?) It suddenly dawned on me that when Oswald shot JFK in 1963, there was not a single person in politics or the media who immediately called for a ban on cheap Italian Mannlicher-Carcano infantry carbines. It seems that 60 years ago, we had the smarts and common sense to blame the shooter rather than the weapon.
And now we don't.
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MDDad
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Post by MDDad on Jun 8, 2022 9:02:24 GMT -8
And another thing:
Why is it that the left is so adamant about air-tight background checks for potential gun buyers, but they don't want background checks, or even simple ID or documentation, for illegal immigrants, voters, or candidates for political office?
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billb
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Post by billb on Jun 8, 2022 10:32:41 GMT -8
And another thing: Why is it that the left is so adamant about air-tight background checks for potential gun buyers, but they don't want background checks, or even simple ID or documentation, for illegal immigrants, voters, or candidates for political office? |
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Post by ProfessorFate on Jun 8, 2022 20:16:10 GMT -8
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Bick
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Post by Bick on Jun 9, 2022 8:51:56 GMT -8
I was reading something about presidential assassinations yesterday when I had a thought (I know, shocking, right?) It suddenly dawned on me that when Oswald shot JFK in 1963, there was not a single person in politics or the media who immediately called for a ban on cheap Italian Mannlicher-Carcano infantry carbines. It seems that 60 years ago, we had the smarts and common sense to blame the shooter rather than the weapon. And now we don't. That's the crux of pretty much every problem in the US... The push for the elimination of personal accountability, and replacing it with more governance. Student loans, mortgage forgiveness, etc are examples. |
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I don't see any upside to more gun regulations PLUS we should consider removing some of what we have. 
