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Post by vilepagan on Apr 19, 2020 12:27:50 GMT -8
I see. Sort of a gradual approach to solving the problem. Now explain to me why that won't work with gun control and gun violence.
The point of gun control isn't to "fix" the problem of gun violence, it's point has always been to be part of the solution. None of these issues has one single solution after all.
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RSM789
Eminence Grise
Posts: 2,286
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Post by RSM789 on Apr 19, 2020 14:34:54 GMT -8
I see. Sort of a gradual approach to solving the problem. Now explain to me why that won't work with gun control and gun violence. Gun control is not a gradual solution to gun violence because it makes the problem worse, not better. Further, gun control does not address the underlying cause of the problem, which is violence, not guns. Lastly, nearly all gun control legislation is based on concepts that are an infringement on our 2nd amendment rights and the inalienable right to defend ones self. |
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Post by vilepagan on Apr 20, 2020 4:06:51 GMT -8
What utter nonsense.
And increased border security doesn't address the underlying cause of the problem either but you're ok with that.
Please tell me where you got this "inalienable right to defend ones self[sic]". Certainly isn't in the Constitution or the DOI. Just making shit up again?
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davidsf
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 5,252
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Post by davidsf on Apr 20, 2020 5:05:21 GMT -8
I see. Sort of a gradual approach to solving the problem. Now explain to me why that won't work with gun control and gun violence. Gun control is not a gradual solution to gun violence because it makes the problem worse, not better. Further, gun control does not address the underlying cause of the problem, which is violence, not guns. Lastly, nearly all gun control legislation is based on concepts that are an infringement on our 2nd amendment rights and the inalienable right to defend ones self. I’m not sure to which post he is responding, but to answer his question, all gun control measures put forth so far only try to limit the freedom of legal, trained gun owners. Oh sure, you might proscribe the purchase of a gun by some guy who only wants it to kill himself, but far and away the gun violence you snowflakes are always harping about is NOT CAUSED BY LEGAL, TRAINED gun owners. the guns used to inflict violence on another are illegal guns stolen from others and used by people who sneer at those of you who think some idiotic law will even slow them down. further, all gun control measures so far put forth not only abridge freedom we are guaranteed by the U.S. Constitution (that document at which you snowflakes sneer), but restricts a legal and trained citizen from defending himself. |
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Post by vilepagan on Apr 20, 2020 5:28:20 GMT -8
Perhaps you should figure that out before you respond. BTW, what is all this talk about "trained" gun owners? What training do you speak of? Pure hogwash. Did you just imagine this was true or did you just make it up out of thin air so you could believe you had some support for your argument? An estimated 287,400 prisoners had possessed a
firearm during their offense. Among these, more than
half (56%) had either stolen it (6%), found it at the
scene of the crime (7%), or obtained it off the street
or from the underground market (43%). Most of
the remainder (25%) had obtained it from a family
member or friend, or as a gift. Seven percent had
purchased it under their own name from a licensed
firearm dealer.www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/suficspi16.pdf |
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Post by ProfessorFate on Apr 20, 2020 17:35:54 GMT -8
Isn’t the use of the term “heinous villains” a bit manipulative? I really only use that and similar terms in reference to villains that really are heinous (and I seldom even use the term “villain” at all). However, to your point, I see nothing wrong with calling a spade a spade: Those who break the law are, in fact, law-breakers, which we also call “criminals.” to me, it is no simple misdeed to cross an international border illegally. I have to agree here, not sure illegals or those crossing the borders illegally are all considered "heinous" by us as a nation. I'm sure your point was more along the lines of not wanting to de-humanize those seeking a better life by way of crossing a border illegally. I, and my sidekick Max, are unhappy with people painting all us villains as "heinous." Some of us are quite lovable. Any way, people lose sight of the real reason we want control of our borders. There most certainly ARE undesirables trying to cross our border, just as there ARE some very fine people trying to cross our borders. We need to gain control of our borders so that we can have some control over exactly which of those two groups the prospective immigrants belong to. Once we have that control, we can afford to make it easier to enter the country LEGALLY. |
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Post by ProfessorFate on Apr 20, 2020 17:51:20 GMT -8
Perhaps you should figure that out before you respond. BTW, what is all this talk about "trained" gun owners? What training do you speak of? Pure hogwash. Did you just imagine this was true or did you just make it up out of thin air so you could believe you had some support for your argument? An estimated 287,400 prisoners had possessed a
firearm during their offense. Among these, more than
half (56%) had either stolen it (6%), found it at the
scene of the crime (7%), or obtained it off the street
or from the underground market (43%). Most of
the remainder (25%) had obtained it from a family
member or friend, or as a gift. Seven percent had
purchased it under their own name from a licensed
firearm dealer.
www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/suficspi16.pdfThanks for making the case of whomever you were responding to. How many of those "found at the scene" were stolen from others? How many of those "obtained off the street, or from the underground market" were stolen from others? How many of those guns "received as a gift from a family member or friend" were stolen from others? The only ones your tougher laws would have blocked, would be the 7% who purchased the gun legally. And if your proposed laws aren't intended to stop the 7% obtained legally...then they wouldn't stop ANY guns at all, and therefore aren't even worth your trouble. |
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Credo
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 6,242
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Post by Credo on Apr 20, 2020 20:08:25 GMT -8
President Trump Announces Executive Order Suspending All Immigration…liberal heads are exploding already (see Andrea Mitchell below), while the overwhelming majority of Americans will support this temporary measure and see it for what it is--a common sense response to the task of rebuilding our economy in the face of the current crisis facing the nation. Once we're back at full employment and have rebounded from this self-inflicted wound, THEN and only then will be the time to consider exactly what outside labor may be necessary.
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RSM789
Eminence Grise
Posts: 2,286
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Post by RSM789 on Apr 20, 2020 20:40:50 GMT -8
What utter nonsense. And increased border security doesn't address the underlying cause of the problem either but you're ok with that. Please tell me where you got this "inalienable right to defend ones self[sic]". Certainly isn't in the Constitution or the DOI. Just making shit up again? Wrong, wrong & wrong. |
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Credo
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 6,242
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Post by Credo on Apr 20, 2020 22:38:38 GMT -8
What utter nonsense. And increased border security doesn't address the underlying cause of the problem either but you're ok with that. Please tell me where you got this "inalienable right to defend ones self[sic]". Certainly isn't in the Constitution or the DOI. Just making shit up again? Wrong, wrong & wrong. Someone here has tested negative for making sense. |
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Post by Oakley on Apr 20, 2020 23:31:31 GMT -8
What utter nonsense. And increased border security doesn't address the underlying cause of the problem either but you're ok with that. Please tell me where you got this "inalienable right to defend ones self[sic]". Certainly isn't in the Constitution or the DOI. Just making shit up again? It's a fact that gun control laws affect law abiding citizens and not criminals. Gun control and border security are two different things that are totally unrelated. The right to keep and bear arms in the United States is a fundamental right protected by the Second Amendment to the United States Constitution, part of the Bill of Rights, and by the constitutions of most U.S. states. |
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Post by vilepagan on Apr 21, 2020 3:03:44 GMT -8
Thanks for making no sense at all.
I have no idea and neither do you, but for some reason you're willing to assume they were ALL stolen so you can make an argument. Not impressed.
Totally incorrect. One of the big problems that you don't want to address is the so called 'gun show loophole' in the current laws which allows people to legally sell their firearms to anyone without a background check or any oversight whatsoever. This is a big part of the "black market". This is a problem we could solve with better gun control laws.
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Post by vilepagan on Apr 21, 2020 3:08:01 GMT -8
If you guys want to join the conversation try posting something remotely meaningful.
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Post by vilepagan on Apr 21, 2020 3:09:55 GMT -8
Rather depends on what law you're talking about doesn't it?
Thank you for stating the obvious.
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Credo
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 6,242
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Post by Credo on Apr 21, 2020 11:08:56 GMT -8
I'm not sure about the content of the three "hidden posts" above, but I'll continue to take the chance I'm not missing much.
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