SK80
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 7,376
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Post by SK80 on Oct 9, 2020 5:31:20 GMT -8
As we all get our ballots here in California I thought I would open discussion and/or debate on this elections Proposition, usually more loony than the candidates themselves... if ever there was deception and backdoor dealings, its the California Proposition game... I have faithfully followed Tom McClintock and usually look to his take and endorsements on the propositions set forth, egos year I am with him on all..  Congressman Tom McClintock, Flashreport, 9/21/20 Proposition 14 – Brewster’s Billions: NO. “Brewster’s Millions” tells the story of a fictional character in 1902, who, in order to inherit $7 million, must first spend $1 million in a year and have nothing to show for it. In 2004, California voters were convinced to spend $3 billion on Stem Cell research – or about $260 (plus interest) for every family in California. A recent report found that $2.1 billion went to beneficiaries with links to the board that doles out the money. That money is now all but spent, with nothing to show for it. So, they’re back with another bond, this one for $5.5 billion (about $478 per family). This is amusing only as fiction.
Proposition 15 – How Not to Succeed in Business: NO. From the “How Tone Deaf Can They Be” file comes this proposal to reassess businesses annually in order to hike their property taxes. That’s because the state-ordered lockdowns, the arrests of shopkeepers trying to keep their businesses going, combined with California’s highest-in-the-country income and sales taxes and anti-business regulations, have left California’s small businesses flush with cash. It is still possible to build a successful small business in California, as long as you start with a successful large one. And remember, businesses don’t pay taxes: YOU pay business taxes, as a consumer through higher prices, as an employee through lower wages or as an investor through lower earnings (think 401k).
Proposition 16 – Judging People by the Color of their Skin and Not the Content of the Character: NO. In the Parents Involved Case of 2007, Chief Justice Roberts noted that “The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race.” California voters had come to the same conclusion when they passed Proposition 209 in 1996, which forbids state government from discriminating or giving preferential treatment “on the basis of race, sex, color, ethnicity or national origin in public employment, public education, and public contracting.” Prop 16 repeals this civil rights protection for all Californians and opens a new era of official discrimination based on race.
Proposition 17 – Bank Robbers for Biden: NO. If there were any doubt of the Democrats’ contempt for the electorate, this should dispel it. This bill gives felons on parole the right to vote. Enough said.
Proposition 18 – High School Voters: NO. Wait, there’s more! Here’s a proposal to give 17-year-olds the right to vote in primary and special elections. Democrats are counting on their good judgment, experience and common sense to counter the influence of their nagging, annoying and totally unreasonable parents.
Proposition 19 – Fire Sale: NO. Right now, parents can leave the family home to their family without a crippling property tax hike. This bill ends that exemption, purportedly to add more money for firefighting. It’s a good bet that more family homes will be lost in fire sales than in fires.
Proposition 20 – A Step Back from the Abyss: YES. Long version: This measure repairs some of the damage of Jerry Brown era laws that have made California less safe. It increases penalties for many theft and fraud crimes that Brown reduced to misdemeanors, requires convicts to submit DNA for state and federal databases and restores the ability of parole boards to keep dangerous prisoners behind bars. Short version: Jerry Brown opposes it.
Proposition 21 – Rent Control with Nothing to Rent: NO. There’s an old soviet-era saying, “What good is a free bus ticket in a city with no buses?” The same is true of rent. Rent controls are very effective at drying up the supply of rental housing in any community where they’re imposed. Those currently renting do very well, but they hold on to their old apartments and landlords stop building new ones. Presto: nothing to rent – but at a very affordable price.
Proposition 22 – Let My Uber Go: YES. One of the worst bills ever enacted by the California legislature (and that says a lot) is AB 5, that essentially ended independent contracting in California. This measure exempts app-based drivers, meaning independent contractors put out of work by AB 5 can still take an Uber to a free state.
Proposition 23 — Bringing Venezuelan Heath Care to Dialysis Patients: NO. Two years ago, SEIU tried to impose price controls on dialysis. They lost and are back with this measure that imposes onerous and expensive requirements to have physicians on duty at dialysis clinics and prohibiting them from going out of business without state approval. This will help dialysis patients by assuring higher prices and will help encourage new clinics to open by forbidding them ever to close. Makes perfect sense.
Proposition 24 – When in Doubt, Don’t: NO. This measure purports to expand consumer privacy, but the Electronic Frontier Foundation, a consumer privacy group, calls it “a mixed bag of partial steps backwards and forwards.” Here’s what is crystal clear: it will unleash a new regulatory agency with vast powers to prosecute businesses that run afoul of the increasingly intricate consumer privacy laws in California. Another nail in the coffin of the once “Golden State.”
Proposition 25 – Catch and Release: NO. When suspects are arrested, they’re jailed until posting bail to assure they show up for trial. Surprisingly, many suspects don’t want to; go figure. Jerry Brown and the lunatic legislature did away with this process in 2018, replacing cash bail with “risk assessments.” This law was temporarily suspended pending this referendum, but the leftist Judicial Council did away with bail for most crimes during the COVID scare, resulting in the arrest, immediate release and subsequent re-arrests of criminal suspects the same day for different crimes. A NO vote would repeal this insane law.
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Bick
Administrator 
Posts: 6,900
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Post by Bick on Oct 9, 2020 6:43:05 GMT -8
Thanks for passing this. Do you have a link to the actual propositions with a pro / con summary?
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thefrog
Eminence Grise
Posts: 1,819
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Post by thefrog on Oct 9, 2020 6:56:41 GMT -8
22 is the biggest one for me...
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SK80
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 7,376
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Post by SK80 on Oct 9, 2020 7:02:33 GMT -8
Thanks for passing this. Do you have a link to the actual propositions with a pro / con summary? As in the one the state sends you with bogus arguments?!?! There seems to be a fairly majority view from conservative/libertarian points of view on these props for November.., most are all "NO" except 20 and 22. I posted this to see if there is anyone here whom had a strong position against what is endorsed here by Tom McCLintock whom I have always found to be one that really understands how these things are written. Although how these get passed can effect all Californians to various degrees, there are some just based on ideological differences. In California, its mostly propositions to raise your taxes to bail out a failing Sacramento. It's pretty easy to trace how that is achieved if you really study. However most are written to deceive, pull heart strings like "for the poor children" etc. This year the are repacking a failed Prop 5 from 2018 in which they want to go back door and hurt long time property owners by getting more reassessments on property tax bases. They are using the poor fire victims and fire fighters as their front. Bless those whom lost their homes, bless our first responders, but this is bogus propaganda. Like most propositions, on the surface its look here! But the real impact is achieved from don't look over here..... |
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SK80
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 7,376
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Post by SK80 on Oct 10, 2020 13:24:51 GMT -8
22 is the biggest one for me... 15 and 19 for me. Both are attempts at undoing the/our old PROP 13. Prop 15 would reassess commercial real estate to market, imagine the train wreck that would create. In a time with half empty buildings, declining commercial real estate value they would tack a huge tax hike to building owners. Prop 19 is fronted by the fires and backed by the CA Realtor Association. This was Prop 5 in 2018 which lost 60/40. This time they are using the fires, fire victims and Fire unions to get sympathy. If passed it would reassessments most Parent - Child transfers or inheritance. As it is now a child can keep their parents/family tax base. The realtors want this because it would force many to most to have to sell as the reassessment to market would become unaffordable. VOTE NO on PROP 15 & 19 !! |
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duke
Statesman
Posts: 681
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Post by duke on Oct 10, 2020 15:17:45 GMT -8
Thank you SK80 for posting. I've been collecting my election mail and was going to go through all of the flyers and decide how to vote.
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SK80
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 7,376
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Post by SK80 on Oct 10, 2020 20:00:43 GMT -8
Thank you SK80 for posting. I've been collecting my election mail and was going to go through all of the flyers and decide how to vote. Duke, many if not most of the flyers are BOGUS political fronts..., especially the COPS VOTER GUIDE.... read the small print on these flyers then go to their sites.... pathetic, disinformation.... I'm pretty grounded in the yeahs or Nays above... YES on 20 and 22 and No on the rest. |
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Post by Oakley on Oct 10, 2020 20:16:40 GMT -8
As we all get our ballots here in California I thought I would open discussion and/or debate on this elections Proposition, usually more loony than the candidates themselves... if ever there was deception and backdoor dealings, its the California Proposition game... I have faithfully followed Tom McClintock and usually look to his take and endorsements on the propositions set forth, egos year I am with him on all.. for posting this SK. I have utmost respect for Tom McClintock. I have contacted his office several times with questions over the years and they were always answered promptly. |
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thefrog
Eminence Grise
Posts: 1,819
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Post by thefrog on Oct 11, 2020 7:34:37 GMT -8
We’ve been fighting this independent contractor BS (the ABC test now) for a while... YES YES YES on 22. It doesn’t completely fix the mess CA has made, but at least it saves the drive share industry that so many of us have utilized.
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davidsf
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 5,252
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Post by davidsf on Oct 11, 2020 8:34:00 GMT -8
I caution you guys to read the wording of your propositions AS YOU VOTE (and do not rely solely on the sample ballots you get) to ensure your “no” really means “no” on the ballot.
our wording in Illinois is written by our state Attorney General and the one initiative on our ballot is profoundly misleading.
our AG is a former state Senator appointed to fill Obama’s unexpired state senate term, and a former state prosecutor for Cook (“Chicago”) County as well as a former Chicago Alderman. He worded the ballot initiative for the proposed “fair” tax to sound like all it will do is allow millionaires to be taxed at a higher rate. What it actually does is rewrite our state constitution to allow our legislators to unrestricted increased taxing power.
just read carefully...
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MDDad
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 6,814
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Post by MDDad on Oct 11, 2020 8:45:23 GMT -8
The misleading wording of ballot propositions is one of the great scams of our electoral process. There's no reason they can't be written or summarized in understandable Englih.
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RSM789
Eminence Grise
Posts: 2,286
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Post by RSM789 on Oct 11, 2020 10:18:17 GMT -8
...ballot propositions... There's no reason they can't be written or summarized in understandable Englih. The same could be said of your post... |
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SK80
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 7,376
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Post by SK80 on Oct 11, 2020 12:16:16 GMT -8
Go easy on the Private School Students there RSM!
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RSM789
Eminence Grise
Posts: 2,286
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Post by RSM789 on Oct 11, 2020 12:36:41 GMT -8
I believe the problem is not one of private school versus public school, but one of Mater Dei versus every other school. As a Servite grad, we learned early on that all the dumb Catholic kids ended up at Mater Dei. Of course, that has now expanded to dumb kids of all creeds, as long as they are athletic.
This is where MDDad comes back with some remark about Servite students being gay, which reinforces the stereotype of Mater Dei stupidity.
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davidsf
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 5,252
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Post by davidsf on Oct 11, 2020 16:00:18 GMT -8
Go easy on the Private School Students there RSM! I was of the understanding MD Dad was the dad of Mater Dei grads, but he, himself is a proud graduate of Anaheim High School, Go Colonists (with any luck at all)... |
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