SK80
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 7,378
|
Post by SK80 on Nov 19, 2019 17:05:00 GMT -8
Wait, so MDDad is letting his neighbor do th dirty work?
|
|
MDDad
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 6,815
|
Post by MDDad on Nov 19, 2019 17:08:09 GMT -8
Plausible deniability.
|
|
|
|
Post by ProfessorFate on Nov 19, 2019 18:18:12 GMT -8
Excellent point. But, if that rioting and violence takes place on MDDad's street, and his house is among the ones being vandalized, and assaulted by a rabid crowd, I tend to think gunfire is a real possibility, from the crowd and from MDDad's well armed neighbor. Anyone disagree with that? That's a slight possibility, but my neighbor threatening or firing on vandals and looters is long a way from organizing and fighting a civil war. True unless it snowballs from there, and spreads throughout the state, and maybe even the nation. |
|
Luca
Master Statesman
Posts: 1,317
|
Post by Luca on Nov 19, 2019 18:32:29 GMT -8
Or Luca on the virtue of brevity...  I am microaggressed and you are oppressing me. I feel.......I dunno..... so validated. So liberated from the constraints of common sense...........Luca |
|
RSM789
Eminence Grise
Posts: 2,287
|
Post by RSM789 on Nov 19, 2019 20:41:10 GMT -8
With all due respect, Dave, what freedoms do you really believe are at risk? You can live where you want, drive what you want, work wherever you are qualified, send your kids to school where you want, vacation where you want, and say what you want. What freedoms are so in peril that you might consider shooting another citizen? We have all heard the story of the frog & the pot of boiling water. MDDad, your response is that same fable. Whenever someone on the right complains about freedoms being taken away, those on the left respond with "look how good you have got it". That response is completely irrelevant to the complaint. How good or bad things currently are has no bearing on freedoms being taken away. I can live where I want? Yes, as long as it isn't on a part of the California Coast that the CCC has its grips on or is in the process of returning to its original landscape, or an area where a never-heard-of-before mouse/bird/ant resides, or an area considered sacred by a group of folks who no longer exist or someplace someone decides that no one should live. Yes, you can live where you want, just not there. I can drive what I want? Yes, as long as it meets the multitude of regulations handed down by un-elected bureaucrats or as long as it gets a certain MPG rating or as long as it is registered with a department that is near impossible to deal with. We can set aside where we can drive to, because that is dictated by traffic, roadway conditions and other factors that slowly squeeze your choices down to what is easiest for the government. Yes, You can drive what you want, as long as they approve. I can work where I am qualified? Yes, as long as my age, sex, race and sexual orientation meet the hiring quotas placed on those businesses by the government or if those companies didn't cut back on hiring as a way to cut the costs regulations, minimum wage and other government mandates put upon them or if the company I am qualified for even exists anymore and not driven out of state or out of business by said regulations. Yes, you can work where you are qualified, but the government will determine what the true qualifications are. I can send my kids to the school I want? Yes, as long as the government agrees to it or the school districts don't have a change of heart and redraw the boundaries or I'm willing to pay taxes for public schools that my private school child doesn't attend. Yes, I can send my kids to the school I want, as long as I want what the government wants me to want. I can vacation where I want? Yes, as long as I stay on the provided paths and roadways dictated as approved by the Parks department or if I am willing to drive cross country because getting on a plane requires an ID that the government department in charge of issuing really hasn't been able to issue or if I want to vacation somewhere very close in order to keep our carbon footprint down or someplace that hasn't been closed due to a government shutdown. Yes, I can vacation where I want, as long as it is government approved. I can say what I want? Yes, as long as it meets approval of those on the left or I am financially independent and can survive being "cancelled" or I have control of what I say being heard (i.e., the fascists at TOB and their censorship). Yes, I can say what I want, well at least compared to Canada. One only needs to look at how the stranglehold of larger government and increased regulations has done to our society over the past 100 years. From Wilson to FDR to LBJ to Obama, this slow increased has turned up the water temperature of the pots of water we are living in. It may not be boiling yet, but it is getting closer & closer and if we fail to act now, it will be too late. Lastly, don't confuse the standard of living we currently have with the freedoms we have lost. Life has gotten easier & better due to capitalism and technological advances, not because of increased government control and less freedom. The left loves to swap those two back & forth, trying to credit government programs for advancements that would have actually proceeded even better and faster had government not gotten in the way. As an example, your BFF Wabash would argue endlessly that FDR saved the country through his numerous government programs and that WWII was basically the New Deal on steroids that ended the Great Depression. The truth is that FDR prolonged the Great Depression, in the exact same manner that Obama prolonged the recession of 2008 (which was caused by ill fated government programs). Capitalism is so strong that it can survive repeated attacks by the leech known as government expansion and still solder on. However, if the leech sucks out too much blood, then the host of capitalism will die, as will our republic. |
|
Bick
Administrator 
Posts: 6,901
|
Post by Bick on Nov 19, 2019 21:36:33 GMT -8
Or Luca on the virtue of brevity... I am microaggressed and you are oppressing me. I feel.......I dunno..... so validated. So liberated from the constraints of common sense...........Luca Micro-aggressed? This seems straight from JP Sears |
|
|
|
Post by vilepagan on Nov 20, 2019 3:47:03 GMT -8
Just a few points:
You're complaining because you can't build your house in a park or on a reservation.
You're complaining because the government regulates driving licenses and won't let you drive wherever you want. Ok.
Now you're complaining about fictitious "quotas" and burdensome government regulations...while the unemployment rate is as low as it has ever been.
Huh?
You're against government ID? Who knew...you seem to think they're ok for voting.
Is there something you've been prevented from saying?
Your complaints are...interesting.
|
|
davidsf
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 5,252
|
Post by davidsf on Nov 20, 2019 7:04:50 GMT -8
With all due respect, Dave, what freedoms do you really believe are at risk? You can live where you want, drive what you want, work wherever you are qualified, send your kids to school where you want, vacation where you want, and say what you want. What freedoms are so in peril that you might consider shooting another citizen? And if the whack-jobs become such a majority that they vote in a whack-job government to implement a whack-job agenda, isn't that exactly the kind of democracy we claim to love and support? Would you consider blowing them away as the appropriate response? You’re taking my statement to an extreme. I am not saying I will start anytime soon... I am saying that, at some point, this steady stream of rights and freedoms infringements will get to a point where even I will draw a line in the sand at “ENOUGH!” However, to your opening question, a child’s right to life is currently abridged to the whim of the mother. I do not have the freedom to own any firearm I choose, or carry it openly, or at all in certain “protected” areas of the community. I currently cannot keep somewhere around 32% (and rising) of the income I earn. I cannot drive what I want or anywhere I want unless I purchase a registration and a drivers license from the state. I am currently being forced to pay into union pensions but cannot receive any benefits (because our state used the Pension Fund as their slush fund)... note, I’m not suggesting some of the above are not warranted... but they are indications of freedoms that are at risk (or at least veering off in that direction) and, like I say, eventually, I can understand where I might believe it is NOT better to suffer those slings and arrows but, by opposing, end them. |
|
MDDad
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 6,815
|
Post by MDDad on Nov 20, 2019 8:48:13 GMT -8
By "draw a line in the sand", do you mean blowing away your neighbor in a civil war?
Actually, you pretty much do...unless you believe the Second Amendment guarantees you the right to own things like flamethrowers, bazookas and grenade launchers. Do you?
Are you really proposing that cars not be registered and drivers not be licensed? There are millions of illegal aliens who would agree with you.
By "opposing, end them" do you mean blowing away your neighbor in a civil war?
|
|
|
|
Post by vilepagan on Nov 20, 2019 9:38:38 GMT -8
Actually, you can own flamethrowers, bazookas, and grenade launchers...you can even own tanks and artillery...you just need to pay the transfer tax and get a license for your "destructive devices".
Here's the slo-mo guys shooting watermelons with an M4A3E8, and a 152mm Russian cannon.
|
|
davidsf
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 5,252
|
Post by davidsf on Nov 20, 2019 10:14:20 GMT -8
By "draw a line in the sand", do you mean blowing away your neighbor in a civil war? Again, using emotional, exaggerated wording to describe what I said. So, no... and can we please stop the hyperbole.Actually, you pretty much do...unless you believe the Second Amendment guarantees you the right to own things like flamethrowers, bazookas and grenade launchers. Do you? I was referring more to my ability to carry it freely. But, to your question, I am prohibited from owning a fully automatic rifle.Are you really proposing that cars not be registered and drivers not be licensed? There are millions of illegal aliens who would agree with you. Again, I am not suggesting these are not warranted, but that are still freedoms that are either being limited or have been limited... and this one, specifically, is a direct answer to your posit.By "opposing, end them" do you mean blowing away your neighbor in a civil war? Hyperbole...again. Please stop.Sorry for the interlinear, but easiest way. |
|
|
|
Post by vilepagan on Nov 20, 2019 13:40:38 GMT -8
|
|
davidsf
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 5,252
|
Post by davidsf on Nov 20, 2019 14:06:18 GMT -8
|
|
MDDad
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 6,815
|
Post by MDDad on Nov 20, 2019 14:28:21 GMT -8
RSM, I apologize. I had no idea how much this country's laws, policies, rules and regulations have made your life a living hell. I thought it was all because you went to Servite, so I stand corrected. I propose the following:
I agree. I propose that every linear yard of California coastline be opened to private ownership to the highest bidder. I would put you first in that line of millionaires who would anxiously gobble it all up, but that would be violating the rules, so you'll just have to get in line and wait your turn. Hopefully, you'll be able to buy enough beachfront property to put down a washcloth and one of those little parasols you get in a tropical drink.
I also propose we declare 365 days a year of open season on all those mice, birds and ants that are endangered. But rather than restrict ourselves to them, I propose we also declare open season on bald eagles, gray wolves, grizzly bears, California condors, bison. Survival of the fittest right. And if they go extinct, who gives a shit.
I also propose we eliminate any restrictions on where anyone can build a home. If you or Jeff Bezos wants to build house in Yosemite Valley, right near Bridalveil Fall, have at it.
I agree. I propose that we eliminate all traffic laws and regulations, and all pollution requirements. Cars will no longer need to be registered, no will you or any other driver have to be licensed. I also propose that traffic and roadway conditions not be allowed to dictate how or when you drive. Pedal to the metal under any road and traffic conditions is what I say.
I agree. I propose we eliminate all labor and hiring laws, as well as all environmental regulations and minimum wage standards. The marketplace should decide, right? If some company wants to dump toxic waste on the lot next to your house, they should be able to do so, as long as the owner of the lot agrees. And if some family wants their 8-year-old to work for 50 hours a week for a buck an hour because they need the money, they should have the right to do that as well. Personal choice, right?
I agree. I propose that all school district boundaries and enrollment areas be eliminated. Anybody can send their kids to any schools they want. I also propose that taxes to support public schools be eliminated or made voluntary. If public schools become extinct or fall even deeper into the sewer, tough shit.
I agree. I propose that all national parks, forest rangers and the parks department be eliminated, and that all hiking trails and park roadways be allowed to fall into disrepair. Anyone can hike, bike, off-road, or use recreational vehicles wherever they want. Half Dome and El Capitan would still look awesome even with graffiti scrawled on them, and anyone who wants to chop down a Joshua Tree to take home for a Christmas tree should be allowed to do so. They'll grow back. And of course I propose that no ID of any kind should be required to board an aircraft anywhere in the country.
I agree, except that this forum is proof that you CAN pretty much say what you want without anyone's approval. Now if you want to say something in public, you certainly have that right, and your listeners have the same right to shout you down.
I know my measures won't restore all the freedoms you're almost ready to go to war over, but they should be enough to turn that simmering pot of water a little cooler and prevent you from having to pull out a frog pistol and start shooting you neighbors.
OK, I'll stop being facetious now. RSM, and I think you'll agree that our beliefs are much more alike than they are different. But we certainly differ on what the threshold should be to start a civil war in this country. Such wars may be warranted over whether or not one man has the right to enslave another, but they shouldn't even be considered in jest as a trigger over policy differences. I'd be willing to bet were both rational people, and that rational people can find a happy medium without threatening to or actually blowing each other away.
|
|
MDDad
Master Eminence Grise
Posts: 6,815
|
Post by MDDad on Nov 20, 2019 14:31:06 GMT -8
Dave, yes I am guilty of using hyperbole in my responses. But the real hyperbole started when people began bandying about the idea of a civil war being waged over our political differences. Wouldn't you agree that was way over the top?
|
|
