Bick
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Post by Bick on Dec 21, 2022 13:17:52 GMT -8
Bick, you didn't specify the geographic area this all-star team should come from, so I'll assume it's Southern California. Whether or not this team could beat Mater Dei or St. John Bosco would depend on how well they are coached and how well they can mesh and play together as a team. Correct and correct. The exercise was to see if there was enough aggregate talent remaining to field a competitive team. I doubt we could find 2 teams. |
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SK80
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Post by SK80 on Dec 22, 2022 8:16:26 GMT -8
That was a point I was making on another thread somewhere. Trinity League is really a 2 horse show. The other schools get to play in higher playoff divisions by virtue of playing those 2 and increasing their power rating. I don't see how any elite player not attending Bosco or MD would want to play in the Trinity. I was kinda shocked to only see one kid from the Trinity that would make the all star team from "the rest". Ironic, I walked into the kitchen yesterday after hearing the official news that our coach had stepped down, it led to the plethora of open coaching spots in the Trinity League, she came back with exactly that, "Why would any coach or any good player want to be in that league unless they play for MD or SJB"? My wife may be wavy and privy to some goings on in HSF by default hanging out with me for 22 years but her come back was simply one of pragmatic and logical thinking. |
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Post by frankieboy1 on Dec 22, 2022 9:28:56 GMT -8
That was a point I was making on another thread somewhere. Trinity League is really a 2 horse show. The other schools get to play in higher playoff divisions by virtue of playing those 2 and increasing their power rating. I don't see how any elite player not attending Bosco or MD would want to play in the Trinity. I was kinda shocked to only see one kid from the Trinity that would make the all star team from "the rest". Ironic, I walked into the kitchen yesterday after hearing the official news that our coach had stepped down, it led to the plethora of open coaching spots in the Trinity League, she came back with exactly that, "Why would any coach or any good player want to be in that league unless they play for MD or SJB"? My wife may be wavy and privy to some goings on in HSF by default hanging out with me for 22 years but her come back was simply one of pragmatic and logical thinking. Players want to play against the best. Players want film of them playing against the best to show to college scouts. Coaches want to test themselves against the best. The best is in the Trinity League-where the bottom 4 would beat 99%+ of the HS teams in the country. |
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Bick
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Post by Bick on Dec 22, 2022 17:42:16 GMT -8
The bottom 4 went 1-3 against the Sunset league in the pre-season losing by 3 TD each, and that 1 win was by a TD v the 4th place Newport Harbor team. Those days of them beating everyone else are in the rearview mirror.
Nobody wants to get their ass handed to them in an uncompetitive game anymore than the Christians were fawning over themselves trying to get at the lions. Don't believe me? Check how much talent on the all-county teams came from the other 4.
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Credo
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Post by Credo on Dec 22, 2022 21:49:27 GMT -8
I notice that from your list above, there is only ONE kid from another Trinity League school--and most are from public schools. What that tells me is that the "Trinity League is the best in the nation" hype is largely based on two schools. And I say this from within a TL school. Other than Servite's run in 2021, no other team in the Trinity League has cracked the top national rankings or has made the CIF D1 semifinals--or even been close to getting there--since 2011. The best run anyone else has had was JSerra in 2018--and they were no threat to topple MD or Bosco that year. A few quarterfinals appearances from the other schools, where they were generally blasted. That was a point I was making on another thread somewhere. Trinity League is really a 2 horse show. The other schools get to play in higher playoff divisions by virtue of playing those 2 and increasing their power rating. I don't see how any elite player not attending Bosco or MD would want to play in the Trinity. I was kinda shocked to only see one kid from the Trinity that would make the all star team from "the rest". Well, since there are FOUR of us "also-rans" and only TWO of them, my suggestion (and I understand there's some willingness on the part of other schools to consider at least #1) is to: 1. Kick out St. John Bosco 2. Invite Crean Lutheran to join in Bosco's place 3. Find some way to force Mater Dei to go independent 4. Invite Bishop Amat to join |
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Post by frankieboy1 on Dec 23, 2022 0:51:06 GMT -8
you have to keep in mind that there are still other sports besides football which have to be considered. In most of them the elite programs aren't at Mater Dei or Bosco. As an example-basketball is still led by Mater Dei, but the rest of the schools are very competitive (unlike 20 years ago where MD totally dominated); baseball is led by JSerra and OLu, girls side led by SM and JSerra (with MD basketball still the leader). Servite boys soccer, JSerra girls.
If they could find a way to cut MD/SJB loose for football only it might work. Might be hard to do with MD since it, like SM, is owned by the Diocese of Orange-who is their ultimate decision maker. If the diocese decides it wants to nuke the football program at MD-it can and will do so.
If they made MD go independent in football-I bet the 4 leftovers would still schedule them. I also suspect that the talent level at MD might decrease if it goes independent.
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Bick
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Post by Bick on Dec 23, 2022 7:34:47 GMT -8
That could make the adjustment for football only and leave the other sports the same.
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MDDad
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Post by MDDad on Dec 23, 2022 9:26:36 GMT -8
So it's OK to have dominant programs in all sports except football?
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Bick
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Post by Bick on Dec 23, 2022 11:13:58 GMT -8
That's the only sport I can think of that does this. Let's face it, what's the fun in playing non-competitive games? I cringe every time we play Fountain Valley.
You 2 won...you have pretty much monopolized the elite talent to the point there's really not enough remaining elite players to even give you a game in CA. Why would you want to continue down this path?
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MDDad
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Post by MDDad on Dec 23, 2022 11:45:00 GMT -8
That's the only sport I can think of that does this. That does what? As I posted before, 60% of the All-County Girls Swimming team was from Santa Margarita. That certainly isn't true in football. What chance does anyone have against them when they have amassed all the top talent? The top six girls milers in Orange County are all from JSerra, and several of them were freshmen. How can anyone else in the county hope to compete with that? Should those schools be booted from the league or made to go the independent route? We concentrate our "outrage" on football because that's where our interests lie, but the same goes on in other sports, just with much less visibility. |
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Bick
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Post by Bick on Dec 23, 2022 13:02:42 GMT -8
Have a separate league designation for football.
Fair points. I suppose the biggest reason football has been separated in the past was the injury factor. Sierra Canyon was in the Gold Coast league a couple years ago, but didn't play any other league members.
Seriously, when we play Fountain Valley we have such a size advantage, I'm thankful we pretty much turn it into a 7v7 game so those kids don't get hurt.
Watching your front 7 guys v. us was jaw-dropping. You'd win 100 out of 100 against us, and we were the #2 team in the county with the most talented team we've ever had, averaged nearly 50 pts a game against the toughest schedule we've ever had...and you f'n bageled us! We beat the #3 team in your league by 20 - I can only guess that's why coaches and players are jumping ship there.
I don't fault you at all for putting together the program you have. While certainly not a popular view here and elsewhere, it's pretty darn pressive you've convinced elite players that playing limited reps at MD is better than being a dude anywhere else.
Think about Kassius...he was a starter for us, but would be what, your #6-7 wr?
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MDDad
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Post by MDDad on Jan 1, 2023 19:04:57 GMT -8
Eric Sondheimer reported this morning that the JSerra baseball team has 20 players with D-1 college offers. How is that possible for a tiny private school in San Juan Capistrano with the highest tuition in the league? Should they be kicked out of the Trinity League and made to go independent, or do we not care because it's not football?
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SK80
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Post by SK80 on Jan 2, 2023 7:19:51 GMT -8
Should they be kicked out of the Trinity League and made to go independent, or do we not care because it's not football? The difference lies in most eyes on football because in that sport the talent levels equal physical harm and abuse. |
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Bick
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Post by Bick on Jan 2, 2023 8:22:49 GMT -8
I couldn't find that post, but think the concept is the same for any sport.
The only caveat is that football has a much greater injury risk when there is such a huge size advantage.
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Post by outofstate on Jan 2, 2023 11:06:12 GMT -8
I agree with MDDad that we are having this discussion only because we care more about football.
Consider MD basketball. In Gary McKnight’s 40 years at the helm, MD has won 39 league titles. The only year they did not win league was the Angelus back in 1988 when Bishop Amat won. But MD still won CIF that season when they beat Amat in the finals. The dominance of MD basketball over the last 40 years is much greater than the current dominance of the football team. Now other teams like Sierra Canyon have overtaken MD in basketball. But the diocese never kicked MD basketball out of their league 🤷♂️
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