Bick
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Post by Bick on Apr 19, 2019 5:42:20 GMT -8
Experience suggests it might get a little hot here as long time, competitive rivalries often do. Mater Dei - Servite rivalry is the longest running that I'm aware of, and their respective supporters will likely have the most spirited takes. While objectivity is the overarching mission of this board, partisanship of ones school will likely be the MO on this thread. I think that's where partisanship belongs...your family, your country, your school. As non-Trinity affiliates, but occasional combatants, there are some others here that might offer a bit of objectivity in these discussions.
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MDDad
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Post by MDDad on Apr 19, 2019 7:57:35 GMT -8
I don't recall the Mater Dei defense going 9 for 23 with 5 interceptions (two returned for touchdowns) against Tesoro in Barkleys last game as a high schooler.
Really, RSM? You're going to pick one anecdotal game to prove Matt Barkley sucked? Did you know that Tom Brady threw for only 123 yards and no TDs with four picks in a game against a crappy 6-10 Buffalo team in 2003? Or that he threw for no TDs and four picks against Indianapolis in 2006? I guess he really sucks too, right?
Bick, this is what makes Mater Dei-Servite the best high school rivalry in Southern California, although a monarch against a wimpy monk in a dingy brown robe is a bit of a mismatch.
RSM, I give up. This "great player" thread, as well as the one on "inalienable rights" proves you will dig in your heels even when you are 100% wrong. I suspect you first learned that tactic when you chose which high school to attend.
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RSM789
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Post by RSM789 on Apr 19, 2019 8:35:57 GMT -8
Bick, don't worry about it getting heated. I have fun with MDDad & other Mater Dei supporters because most have drunk the Kool Aid and believe their sports program is the greatest in the history of mankind. I don't take it seriously. Mater Dei wasn't even a rival of Servites when I was there, that distinction belonged to St Paul, whose football team was one of the dirtiest in the 70's. Mater Dei apparently got jealous from the lack of attention following Servites back to back titles in the early 80's and began the change to a sports academy hidden in Catholic school clothing. So once again, Servite was cast as the good guy having to fight against the cheating heel.
Re Barkley, it wasn't one anecdotal game, it was one of the biggest games in Barkleys high school career. They were playing an undefeated Tesoro squad and the Mater Dei defense did an admirable job against a solid offense, even though Barkley kept coughing up the ball and giving Tesoro additional possessions or points. If you claim that Mater Dei's defense was pathetic and Barkley was great, how does that stand up in the face of the results of that big game? The exact opposite of what you claim occurred.
By the way, I never claimed Barkley sucked, I was just making the point that he wasn't a great player. He was way too talented and too good of a young man to be classified as a bad player, he just never made it into the great category. There are degrees in-between the extremes.
I don't believe I chose Servite to go to, at age 14 I believe that choice was my parents. Like now, Mater Dei was reserved for those "slower" kids who couldn't get into the more academically challenging schools. Legend has it that Mater Dei chose red as the school color because it hid the blood their students spilled when they would walk into walls and that their original school slogan was "I'm not that Stoopid!!".
As far as our discussions, there is a simple explanation for your frustration. It has become apparent that you argue from your conclusions, not from reason. You have a conclusion in your mind (i.e., Mater Dei is a wonderful school) and then you try to build an argument to support that. Had you been fortunate enough to attend Servite, you would have learned the proper way is to use reason to examine the aspects of a situation and then draw your conclusion from there. But alas, it is near impossible to teach old Austrian dogs new tricks, so we will just have o live with what we have got.
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Bick
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Post by Bick on Apr 19, 2019 9:06:57 GMT -8
Bick, don't worry about it getting heated. I have fun with MDDad & other Mater Dei supporters because most have drunk the Kool Aid and believe their sports program is the greatest in the history of mankind. I don't take it seriously. Mater Dei wasn't even a rival of Servites when I was there, that distinction belonged to St Paul, whose football team was one of the dirtiest in the 70's. Mater Dei apparently got jealous from the lack of attention following Servites back to back titles in the early 80's and began the change to a sports academy hidden in Catholic school clothing. So once again, Servite was cast as the good guy having to fight against the cheating heel. Re Barkley, it wasn't one anecdotal game, it was one of the biggest games in Barkleys high school career. They were playing an undefeated Tesoro squad and the Mater Dei defense did an admirable job against a solid offense, even though Barkley kept coughing up the ball and giving Tesoro additional possessions or points. If you claim that Mater Dei's defense was pathetic and Barkley was great, how does that stand up in the face of the results of that big game? The exact opposite of what you claim occurred. I'm sure everyone here will keep it acceptably civil. Some of the folks new to this rivalry might raise an eyebrow, but I'm not at all concerned. Now I will take issue with that Tesoro game being the biggest of his senior season. I'd like to point out in the 2nd game of the 2008 year, he and his cohorts shredded the mighty Centurions from Cypress 49-7. I remember that game vividly as the support staff was kind enough to bring me the drive summary after each of the 7 TD's. 1 play - 65 yds 2 plays - 77 yds 1 play - 45 yds 3 plays (a moral victory) - 83 yds ...and so forth. And this was no slouch of a Cypress team, as the following year, 2009...you remember 2009, right...those same Centurions beat got hosed by Zebra (j/k Zeb) and lost to a Max Wittek led team 21-16. |
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Luca I forgot my password
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Post by Luca I forgot my password on Apr 19, 2019 9:20:45 GMT -8
RSM draws blood as MDDad silently vows vengance and plans his counter thrust.
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RSM789
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Post by RSM789 on Apr 19, 2019 10:47:23 GMT -8
When I saw the "Luca I forgot my password", I literally laughed out loud. I envision an Albert Einstein character, full on genius, cursing his newfangled electronic gadgets...
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RSM789
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Post by RSM789 on Apr 19, 2019 10:53:37 GMT -8
... I'd like to point out in the 2nd game of the 2008 year, he and his cohorts shredded the mighty Centurions from Cypress 49-7. The mighty Monarchs defense gave up 7 points to a public school team, a team they probably didn't even steal any players from? How pathetic!!  |
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Bick
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Post by Bick on Apr 19, 2019 11:42:28 GMT -8
In light of last year's "defection" of a certain group of affiliated players and coaches from Los Al to the monochromatic school to the east on La Palma, I don't think I'd be throwing many rocks from that glass house.
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RSM789
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Post by RSM789 on Apr 19, 2019 12:11:55 GMT -8
Trust me, I am the last person to defend Servite from their choice to join the recruiting squads.
The Servite I went to was a Catholic school that happened to be private and would have up years & down years in sports based on what Catholic families happened to live nearby with kids bright enough to pass the entrance test (the ones who failed it ended up at Mater Dei). I think it is unfortunate that Servite (& the other parochial high schools) are now private schools who happen to be Catholic and their sports programs success is based nearly entirely on how well they recruited athletes that are neither Catholic nor from the nearby areas.
These schools were founded as a way to provide an alternate education to Catholic families concerned with the curriculum of public schools. The schools have since sold their souls and abandoned that mission, becoming elite private sports academies that many Catholic families have no chance of getting their children into.
But other than that, they are great...
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Bick
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Post by Bick on Apr 19, 2019 12:55:34 GMT -8
I went to parochial school thru 9th grade (Saint Anthony's in LB for 9th grade), and got a very good sense about what it was all about. It would be a shame if the schools lowered their standards for the purpose of winning at sports. And honestly, even if they have, I would guess it's not widespread, and maybe limited to 1-5% of the enrollees.
From a pure football sense, I admire how good those teams in the Trinity are. "Best in the nation" is something many should be proud of. I'm somewhat of a free-market guy, so I really don't get all that bothered when players, coaches, or both leave your school because the chose perceived greener pastures. I've made my position pretty clear over there about how those transfers should be treated as it relates to competition and playoffs.
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Post by coach on Apr 19, 2019 14:17:08 GMT -8
I felt bad for Matt and the offense. They had to score at least 4 to 6 TD's just to win a game. In my humble opinion, the Eric Johnson-less defense was too busy reading their 62 different plays on their wrist bands to make the plays. There I said it. One more thing, Matt really didn't have the marquis receivers we have enjoyed the last few years.
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MDDad
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Post by MDDad on Apr 19, 2019 14:48:44 GMT -8
In his four years at Mater Dei, Matt Barkley's only two recruited receivers were:
Kyle Brown, who's motivation and work ethic were abysmal. He had two offers, went to Oregon State, and never accomplished anything
Robbie Boyer, Matt's cousin. Robbie had one offer from Harvard, walked on at USC, and rarely saw the field in his four years there.
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RSM789
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Post by RSM789 on Apr 19, 2019 15:10:20 GMT -8
Here is the thing that will make you smile. Of those 3 young men you named, one's parents is a client of mine, as is the shared grandparents of two of them.
I gave the Servite/Tesoro disclaimer (with a smirk & a laugh) the first time we met.
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Luca
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Post by Luca on Apr 19, 2019 15:51:18 GMT -8
Didn't Jeff Diulio (sp?) also play with Barkley? He always reminded me of Jack Biletnikof. I really admired that player and how he maximized his ability with his hands and routes......................Luca
By the way, Bick, what is this "sage" bullshit with MDDad? Like you just get a sticker for volume of posts? I think we have to grade on quality as opposed to quantity. Any old retired octegenarian like that with no friends and nothing else to do can post endlessly.......................
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MDDad
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Post by MDDad on Apr 19, 2019 16:14:51 GMT -8
Jeff Diulio was a senior in 2000 and played with Matt Leinart. Barkley arrived five years later.
And I think you become a Sage when you hit 200 posts. So another 63 and you'll be one too, except it'll be spelled Saggy.
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